Navigating the New Administration: with Rusty Rumley of the National Agricultural Law Center

Season 5: Episode 203
In this episode of North American Ag Spotlight, host Chrissy Wozniak is joined by Rusty Rumley, Senior Staff Attorney at the National Agricultural Law Center, to explore the shifting landscape of agricultural policy under the new administration.

They discuss the recent election outcomes, highlighting the Republican control of both chambers of Congress and the White House, and speculate on what this might mean for agricultural legislation, particularly the Farm Bill. Rusty provides insights into the complexities of passing a Farm Bill with a narrow majority, the potential use of the Congressional Review Act to repeal recent regulations, and the significant changes brought by the end of the Chevron deference, which could require clearer directives from Congress on policy. 

The conversation also delves into how budget reconciliation could impact nutrition programs in the Farm Bill, emphasizing the critical balance between SNAP benefits and agricultural support. Additionally, they touch on the ongoing debates regarding foreign ownership of U.S. farmland, with specific attention to state-level actions and potential federal policy adjustments. Rusty looks to the future with cautious optimism, suggesting that while significant changes might be limited, there could be beneficial tweaks ensuring more stability in agricultural policy. 

The episode wraps up with Rusty explaining the role of the National Agricultural Law Center as a neutral source of legal information for the ag community, encouraging listeners to engage with their resources. 

For more in-depth analysis, subscribe to the National Agricultural Law Center's updates at https://nationalaglawcenter.org/category/the-feed/ and follow North American Ag Spotlight on any podcast platform and video channels like Rumble and Telegram.

#agpolicy #farming #agriculture

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Transcript

00:00:17:05 - 00:00:49:21
Chrissy Wozniak
Hi, and welcome to North American tech spotlight. I'm Chrissy Wozniack. Our returning guest today is a leader in agricultural banking. With over 40 years of experience from teaching ag finance and accounting to holding executive roles at Farmer Mac and Big of the West. His expertise has really shaped the entire maglite, lending industry. Currently, he serves as the Senior Director of Institution Credit at AG America, America's largest non-bank ag lender.

00:00:49:23 - 00:01:14:10
Chrissy Wozniak
And today, we're going to dive into AG America's to 2025 economic outlook for U.S. agriculture. And this report offers a deep dive into critical shifts in farm income, input costs, debt levels, and federal policies as well, all aimed at helping America's farmers, ranchers and landowners prepare for the future. So joining me today from Lakeland, Florida, please welcome Kurt Covington.

00:01:14:14 - 00:01:17:14
Chrissy Wozniak
Welcome, Kurt. Pleasure to have you on the show again.

00:01:17:16 - 00:01:19:08
Curt Covington
Thank you.

00:01:19:10 - 00:01:25:05
Chrissy Wozniak
So for those new to the show, can you share a bit about your background and what brought you to your current role, AG America?

00:01:25:08 - 00:01:48:07
Curt Covington
Sure. Actually, Matt, in California right now, I'm with a number of growers are kind of caught, caught up in these, wildfires. So I grew up in farming. California. Still, not to the extent that my family used to farm, but we still farm out here in California. I do live in Lakeland, Florida now. I grew up, as an egg banker starting in 1979.

00:01:48:09 - 00:02:15:02
Curt Covington
So I'm actually getting closer to 50 years of ag banking, and started out in, out in California, neg banking, moved through the Midwest, ended up in Washington, DC as you it's, so accurately pointed out is, chief credit officer at Farmer Mac and then, came down to actually, spent a few days in retirement because it was it was time.

00:02:15:02 - 00:02:24:04
Curt Covington
And then I realized that was probably a bad decision. So I went back to work and, and I'm in, joined myself.

00:02:24:06 - 00:02:31:24
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah, that's that's great. And so what does AG America focus on? And then how does it really stand out in agriculture lending.

00:02:32:01 - 00:03:13:17
Curt Covington
Yeah. So AG America is not what we would define as a nontraditional, real estate mortgage. Originator. We originate loans, both from a conventional standpoint and nonconventional ones where with we work with a number of borrowers who may be having some financial distress. And our goal with those clients is to what we would define is work them up to get them to the point where they're back on their feet, where they have positive cash flow, have the ability to service their debt and find themselves in a position that they can be back and productive, out in the field, instead of having to worry necessarily about where their financing is going to

00:03:13:17 - 00:03:29:03
Curt Covington
come from. So we've been a good partner both to farmers that, are seeing success. And we, as you well know, Chrissy, there are farmers that are not having success right now from a financial standpoint. So we work with both of them. We're proud to do so.

00:03:29:05 - 00:03:40:08
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah, that's that's really important. So let's let's jump into the report. What inspired America to create this resource. And and then who is it primarily aimed at?

00:03:40:10 - 00:04:19:01
Curt Covington
Yeah. You know Christy there's a lot of these resources out there. And it's interesting because, you know, going from one spectrum to the other, a lot of those resources may not have people that have boots on the ground that are actually seeing what's going on in the world of agriculture and in the world of agricultural finance. And, so while, a lot of reports that you see out there may talk about the economic implications of this and the policy of that, our report is really more based on what we're seeing from our growers and from the markets that we serve, which we'd like to say it's all 50 states, but I'm trying to

00:04:19:01 - 00:04:25:08
Curt Covington
remember if we've ever done anything in Alaska. But, for sure, 49 states.

00:04:25:10 - 00:04:36:15
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah. That's good. So the report highlights a decline in net farm income with a projected recovery for 2026. So what are the main factors that are driving these trends?

00:04:36:17 - 00:05:04:11
Curt Covington
Well, you know, we came off a period of time when, farm revenue, was pretty good across all sectors. And input costs prior to say, 2022. As far back as 2021, input costs were moderate, fairly moderate. There was some increase in some of those costs. But starting in 2020 through all the way up through 2024 and even today, input costs have been elevated.

00:05:04:11 - 00:05:27:16
Curt Covington
And some of those costs, we're starting to see moderate, to some extent oil based, input costs. So fertilizer and chemical is one ones we usually talk about. But there are other ones that are not going to moderate anytime soon and probably will remain elevated. One being seed cost, which continues to be, expensive for many, many growers.

00:05:27:18 - 00:05:50:00
Curt Covington
Labor costs. So labor costs, and it depends on the part of the country you're in out here in California, you're paying somebody $25 an hour to get a job done. It. Ten years ago you were paying probably $15 an hour, and I'm talking about the full cost of of that labor. So those costs have increased 50% across the Midwest.

00:05:50:00 - 00:06:22:09
Curt Covington
You're also seeing an increase in labor costs. Most importantly, the one we really don't talk about is, interest costs. And you say, well, Kurt, is it really an input or. My answer is, I don't I know very few farmers that can finance their way through, over the, over their career or over their family's generational existence and farming that hasn't relied on debt in some form or fashion, whether it's real estate or operating debt.

00:06:22:11 - 00:06:49:16
Curt Covington
But operating debt, the cost of operating debt is tripled in its cost since 2022. Now we're starting to see, some possible rate reductions, although more currently, we've seen that inflation is still stubborn. And now there's thoughts that the fed may not be reducing rates, in the near future. So interest cost is one that we really don't talk about.

00:06:49:16 - 00:06:56:20
Curt Covington
And honestly, it's out of control of a lot of people, both the farmer and quite honestly, the banker.

00:06:56:22 - 00:07:14:18
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah. Make sense. Great points. And you touched on, input costs. And you know, stabilizing input costs are a focal point. So can you expand on how these lower feed and fertilizer costs are balancing against the, you know, persistent labor challenges?

00:07:14:20 - 00:07:42:04
Curt Covington
Yeah. So I think part of this is, farmers today are having to decide, between needs and wants when it comes to some of their input costs, because they're dealing with revenues and whether it's corn and soybeans or almonds and table grapes, it really doesn't make any difference. None of those commodities have had a very good year from the revenue side and projected through 2025, with few exceptions.

00:07:42:04 - 00:08:01:14
Curt Covington
I think the revenues still going to be challenged. And Christy, you and I both know and it's you know, it's a very common thing that we talk about in agriculture, on agricultural finance, is that farmers can't control their revenue. They have no way of controlling the price of their commodity. They can hedge it. They can somehow attempt to block that or contract it.

00:08:01:14 - 00:08:25:17
Curt Covington
But the reality of the matter is the price that's offered is the price that's offered. So how does a farmer ensure that they improve their profitability? It's through cost control. And so it's not just deciding what costs that you're going to have to, you know, take extra effort in controlling. But what would that impact be potentially on production, and the quality of your crop.

00:08:25:17 - 00:08:49:20
Curt Covington
And so today, you know, when we talk to farmers, the biggest issue for many of them is how do I get a highly productive crop, high quality crop. Yet at the same time find ways to control the cost. And part of that is, and, you know, it really comes down to this is the farmer has to be very, very, very diligent in dealing with their suppliers.

00:08:49:22 - 00:09:08:19
Curt Covington
They have to push the pencil, what we used to call push the pencil. Now it's work the Excel spreadsheet to decide what costs can I control. And that's the big thing is a lot of people say, well, where do I start? If I'm a farmer, where where do I start? Do I go to my banker and say, hey, drop my interest rate?

00:09:08:21 - 00:09:29:00
Curt Covington
One full percentage point? Highly unlikely. Do I go to my landlord and say, hey, you going to drop my rent by 50%? Probably not going to work. What you gotta do is figure out those costs that you have control over, and those are typically your input costs and decide, how can I best manage those to improve my profitability.

00:09:29:00 - 00:09:51:08
Curt Covington
And then lastly, and I hate to pontificate here, but when we talk about separating needs from wants Christy, it's really more about what capital expenditures are necessary for this operation to continue successfully and which ones are more wants than actual needs.

00:09:51:10 - 00:10:16:07
Chrissy Wozniak
Right. That totally makes sense. Yeah. And you you talked about the debt levels are concerning. And what advice do you have to producers to, to, you know, when they're managing operating loans, even variable rate that how can they do that more effectively or smarter as well as reducing those costs?

00:10:16:09 - 00:10:39:24
Curt Covington
Okay. Here's an old time saying and I'm an old timer. Assets are bought during good times and they're paid for during bad times. Remember that. So these people that bought, you know, farmers bought equipment two years ago during the, you know, the good times or three years during that. They're still making payments on an equipment for another four years.

00:10:40:01 - 00:11:12:06
Curt Covington
Debt and interest costs don't go away. Debt doesn't care what the revenue numbers are. They don't care how bad the economy is. Debt has to get paid. It has to get fed. The second piece of this is, you know, and I encourage people to think about this because I continue to hear across the board. And again, maybe this is more academic than it is actual, where the debt levels in the United States, whether it be farm real estate or operating debt, is still manageable.

00:11:12:06 - 00:11:33:18
Curt Covington
I tend to disagree with that. I think in the last ten years in and I could be wrong about this, but farm real estate debt alone I think is, probably increased. Oh, at least 20, 30%. And the revenues haven't supported that, that increase in that kind of debt. Operating debt, as you can see, is climbing quickly now.

00:11:33:18 - 00:12:03:18
Curt Covington
It's climbing very quickly across the states. Why is that? Because farmers have run out of liquidity. They've run out. They don't have any working capital. So they're having to lean on their lenders. Their lenders obviously are a bit skeptical of where the economy is headed into 2025. So it's this decision about, you know, if I'm going to take on debt, I've got to remember that I have to service that debt, and I have to keep my lender happy and informed.

00:12:03:20 - 00:12:36:09
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah, yeah, that's that's good. And to say the least, we live in politically interesting times. And, you know, I talk about this all the time, you know, policy, you know, there's there's the three things that affect the farm every single day. And that's policy and, finances and gosh. Right. There's those things that they can't really control, but, you know, that that need to, they need to pay attention to and sure, policy is policy.

00:12:36:09 - 00:12:49:13
Chrissy Wozniak
Uncertainty is a is a significant theme. So how are changes in federal support, trade relations and environmental regulations impacting U.S. agriculture? And what are you seeing with the new administration? You know, there's a lot there.

00:12:49:15 - 00:13:15:07
Curt Covington
So I'm I'm a, follower of environmental, practices and environmental legislation when it comes to agriculture. And so my views may not be shared with a lot of people that might be listening to this. I believe that environmental policy has taken the place of rational thinking, particularly at in the western United States, where water is everything we live in a desert out West.

00:13:15:09 - 00:13:37:23
Curt Covington
This isn't a political football. If you want your food, you've got to find the sources of water. You can't be preserving that water necessarily for every environmental cause you can possibly think of. So while again, some people may listen to this and not be happy about what I'm saying, there has to be some balance and there has to be some rational thinking about environmental policy.

00:13:37:23 - 00:14:03:02
Curt Covington
I think obviously this administration has indicated that some of the things that you'll see from an environmental perspective and conservation, there has to be balance. No one has said we have to just throw it out the baby with the bathwater. No one has said that. But there has to be some degree of balance because the cost of servicing environmental causes at the farm gate, there is no return on that to the farm.

00:14:03:04 - 00:14:28:10
Curt Covington
It's just a cost you have to bear. And many of these farmers live with the regulatory environment, but they live in that regulatory environment because what are you going to do, take your farm and go somewhere else? You're not. You're stuck where you're at when it comes to. Yeah. When it comes to, farm policy, I guess we continue to kick this can as usual.

00:14:28:12 - 00:14:59:05
Curt Covington
The the farm bill is going to get cans going to kick down the road until sometime into 2025. I suspect there are a lot of things within the farm bill reference prices and things of that nature for, you know, corn and soybeans that have to be adjusted. It has to be brought into the modern world. Look, in the last three years, the landscape of agriculture, particularly agricultural finance, and I'm saying the cost of farming has changed dramatically and there has to be some consideration for that.

00:14:59:05 - 00:15:21:04
Curt Covington
Also, you know, the crop insurance programs, which, you know, I was talking to a farmer last night and I said to him, you know, the crop insurance program, part of you out of every program that's ever been thought of by the US government is one of the few that actually works. And it works pretty well, and it's for the most part, solvent most of the time.

00:15:21:06 - 00:15:48:10
Curt Covington
It's a shared risk arrangement, and it needs to stay that way. It's not the job of the government to get the taxpayers to pay for every farmer's cost. On the other hand, if you want high quality food at a relatively inexpensive price compared to the rest of the world, you have to live with the idea that the crop insurance program is a key and foundational piece to bringing high quality food to market.

00:15:48:12 - 00:16:15:14
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah, for sure that, you know, Feeding America the risk can't just be on the farmer as well. And you brought up some really great points there. Especially in in navigating common sense, I hope that there will be a bit of a return, you know, the last few years going to DC and sitting in on, you know, USDA and EPA meetings, the lack of common sense is just so obvious.

00:16:15:16 - 00:16:29:05
Chrissy Wozniak
And, and I really look forward to hopefully some of these points are actually from a farming background that know what's going on. So I, I to I'm really hoping for, for some, some common sense changes.

00:16:29:07 - 00:16:53:12
Curt Covington
And I think some of this look, I get it and there's a number of arguments around the the farm bill. Right. Some what, 80%, 75 to 80% of it really is focused on the Snap program. And, nutrition programs totally understand it. Totally supported. Some people think that, there should be a greater, amount of the farm bill.

00:16:53:14 - 00:17:21:12
Curt Covington
That should be allocated conservation. What? They don't realize that remaining 15% that goes to farmers. Half of that is already for conservation. And so people don't realize the farmers really only seeing about 7% of that if you're a general agricultural policy. And so you do get you do get some, you know, across the aisle, consensus around, a, a, a farm bill, but it's going to be $1 trillion farm.

00:17:21:12 - 00:17:26:16
Curt Covington
You know, it's going to be a very expensive farm bill next time around. When this does come up.

00:17:26:18 - 00:17:45:01
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah. There's been a lot of talk back and forth. You know, in, in this community that of separating snap out of farm bill and I can see both sides like it sounds like a good idea, but then having it in, that's really the only way it gets brought out to into the spotlight. What are your thoughts on that?

00:17:45:03 - 00:18:06:19
Curt Covington
Well, there has been talk about that. Should it be moved under Housing and Urban development, should it be moved into finance, should it be moved under its own title? Should it be moved somewhere else? The reality of the matter is, yeah. Again, this is probably one of the few bills where you're going to get consensus. Can you imagine if the Snap program were being dealt with in a highly partizan environment?

00:18:06:20 - 00:18:33:10
Curt Covington
When you're talking about housing and urban development, or if it's in the finance department, your policy would look like, you know, the stock market, you'd have these periods of time when you'd have plenty of support for snap, you'd have these times where there would be depleted sources for snap. And no one, including me, is suggesting that we need, you know, to somehow adjust snap such that, you know, there has to be, you know, some draconian view of how that should be.

00:18:33:12 - 00:18:54:19
Curt Covington
There does need to be some level of consistency. We do need to serve the underprivileged when it comes to that. And so for me, I've struggled with this crisis. Like maybe it is in the right place and, you know, it is tied. It is tied to agricultural production, I suppose. But Christina, where are you going to put it?

00:18:54:21 - 00:18:55:10
Chrissy Wozniak
Right.

00:18:55:12 - 00:18:57:01
Curt Covington
Where do you put it?

00:18:57:03 - 00:19:00:08
Chrissy Wozniak
And you're right about it becoming more politicized if it goes somewhere else.

00:19:00:08 - 00:19:01:08
Curt Covington
So yeah.

00:19:01:10 - 00:19:32:22
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah, it's just a quandary, I think, for sure. And, and I think it's kind of another thing that always bothers me is, you know, it's everybody talks about reaching the consumer, reaching the consumer from our industry. But that's very hard. And, you know, algorithms don't serve us either, you know, on social media very well. But it would be great to get the population to understand that it's, you know, saying no to all chemicals is not an option, right?

00:19:32:22 - 00:19:34:15
Chrissy Wozniak
Like it's,

00:19:34:17 - 00:19:57:23
Curt Covington
Well, that's a deep misunderstanding. That's a deep, deep misunderstanding about biochemicals versus, you know, some people harken back to the world of DDT when it really was a, a, a it was a chemical today. I didn't mean to interrupt you, but there are a lot of chemicals that get sprayed that you have a reentry in 24, 48 hours.

00:19:57:23 - 00:20:17:19
Curt Covington
That's how safe they are. There is a very thin line between organic, natural and conventional farming today, and it's going to become narrower and narrow. And I honestly kind of think the day will come when conventional farming will be seen as suitable, even for those who somehow think that conventional farming is bad today.

00:20:17:21 - 00:20:37:02
Chrissy Wozniak
Right? Yeah. Yeah, definitely. So the report also outlines strategies for leverage, leveraging government programs. So what are some practical examples for for growers to to stay financially resilient through this year where, where their income may not be going back.

00:20:37:04 - 00:20:47:24
Curt Covington
You know, wow. Who knows where what what government policy might look like in 2025 or 2020.

00:20:48:05 - 00:20:49:14
Chrissy Wozniak
And 20 even.

00:20:49:14 - 00:21:15:22
Curt Covington
Yeah, 20. Yeah. Sorry, I'm in 2025. But honestly, we are in a transition at 2025 is not going to be a great year for agriculture. So this really to me is not about what can they leverage outside of their company, you know, outside of their farming enterprise. But what can they leverage inside their farming enterprise? And and I'll be brutally honest, it always gets me in trouble.

00:21:15:22 - 00:21:41:09
Curt Covington
But I guess that's what life is all about, is, is that, you know, when times are good, farmers tend to find a way to, enhance their living style and their their lifestyle and their living expense. It's time for many of these farmers who have a lifestyle or living expense that is not supported by their farming operation, to find a way to whittle that down.

00:21:41:13 - 00:22:04:12
Curt Covington
And that's easier said than done. Someone says, well, we just don't take as much money out of the business. Well, let me remind those people that are saying that is a lot of money that was taken out of the business during the good times, sits in a vacation home in Arizona, right? It sits in other investments they may have made that they still have to feed whatever those investments might be.

00:22:04:14 - 00:22:36:01
Curt Covington
And so it's not an easy thing to do, reducing your lifestyle at this point in time, which is going to be a necessary thing in 2025 into 2026, is not going to be easy. A lot in a lot of farming operations. There's still a lot of pigs feeding at the trough. A lot of people involved in the family operation that probably there needs to be a long and hard discussion about who really need who what, who really wants to be here and who really needs to be here.

00:22:36:03 - 00:23:17:19
Curt Covington
And that's number one. The other thing that I would say you definitely need to leverage, if you're going to leverage outside sources, people that can give you great advice around cost management about, you know, how to properly organize your books, how to properly organize your business. One of the things that I'm a big fan of, and I'll just finish this by saying, sometimes businesses, these farming operations need outside advisors sitting around the family room table and having a blunt discussion about how they run their business, but how they see successful businesses outside of farming, running their businesses.

00:23:17:19 - 00:23:27:19
Curt Covington
And it's a great tool, an excellent tool. And I do that with in a number of situations. And it's it works.

00:23:27:21 - 00:23:46:08
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah, those are some excellent points, but not only for farms but also for for any agribusiness, for any business and then for families as well. You know, there's there's a lot of expenses that, that you can get rid of, and prepare for this coming year ahead before the floodgates open up again.

00:23:46:09 - 00:24:06:22
Curt Covington
That's right. Right, right, right. And really honestly to the end of that also is and I talked about this a couple minutes ago is deciding what you really need to replace. You know, it's the need versus one if it's capital improvements. Don't really need a new pick up. Or do I just really want a new pickup? Do I need a brand new tractor, or do I need a, just a two year old tractor?

00:24:06:22 - 00:24:25:11
Curt Covington
Or do I run with the one that's seven years old? Well, those kind of decisions shouldn't get made just by saying, well, I've always bought a new tractor after three years, so I'm going to continue to buy it. It's always worked for me. Well, maybe it's time to think twice about that, because you have to decide whether the repair and maintenance cost is cheaper than the cost of debt.

00:24:25:14 - 00:24:30:10
Curt Covington
And the cost of debt today still remains very high.

00:24:30:12 - 00:24:38:23
Chrissy Wozniak
Right? Yeah. For sure. So where can listeners access the report and then how do they reach out to you or Egg America? For more information?

00:24:39:00 - 00:25:01:03
Curt Covington
Sure. Erica lending.com. I'm reachable via our website. But they can, you know, people know how to somehow people find ways to find me. I'm available through a resources they can call us, and and I will, and they can reach out to me and I will. I will return their call.

00:25:01:05 - 00:25:08:19
Chrissy Wozniak
And you also speak. I've seen you at a few different events this year, this past year. So if anybody is looking for a speaker, you're great, insightful speaker.

00:25:08:21 - 00:25:18:06
Curt Covington
Yeah. I'm I told someone ask me, what do you charge? I said, I believe in free speech, so I do them for free.

00:25:18:08 - 00:25:23:12
Chrissy Wozniak
That's the theme of 2025 free speech. Right? So you're gonna you're gonna you're gonna be booked all year. Now.

00:25:23:18 - 00:25:46:10
Curt Covington
Exactly. After saying exactly. I think it's important. Look, you know what? These people go to conferences, expect to hear something insightful from somebody, you know, that comes from a different viewpoint. I just happen to be lucky. I grew up in farming. I know farming, I know a little bit about ag lending. And, I also have seen, good deals gone bad.

00:25:46:10 - 00:26:07:15
Curt Covington
I've seen good practices in businesses that work, and I've seen bad practices in businesses that don't work. So you kind of share those things, and then you hope that some of it sticks. It's the old 10% rule. You're hopefully out of that 100% or that hour speaking, they picked up ten, you know, maybe ten minutes worth of useful information.

00:26:07:17 - 00:26:27:06
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah for sure. And I could say I can speak for myself, but I'm sure you probably can relate living in Florida but then also doing a lot of business in California. Yeah. And you can really see how, you know, agriculture is different. No place is perfect, but you can see how policy rules. Leadership really does affect the farm.

00:26:27:06 - 00:26:37:03
Chrissy Wozniak
You know, producers are pretty much alike in mindset, alike in, you know, it's it's the the structure around them that really affects their success rate.

00:26:37:05 - 00:26:57:01
Curt Covington
That's correct. That's exactly right. You know, which you know, which battle do you have to pick and choose and, and what you're going, you know, and, and you raise such a great point because in California, if you're going to try and fight the battle, legislative battle, my general response to that is good luck.

00:26:57:03 - 00:26:58:00
Chrissy Wozniak
Right?

00:26:58:02 - 00:27:31:08
Curt Covington
In, in, in any other state, fighting that like you said something I'm in and I know you, this probably goes off topic, but it's so interesting. How do you get a unified voice in agriculture so the consumers understand, that we're not bad stewards of our assets, like some people would want to tell you that, you know, we we, you know, we ship, you know, 80% of our water in California gets shipped overseas because we use that water to grow crops that we sell to consumers outside of the United States.

00:27:31:10 - 00:28:02:21
Curt Covington
You know, a lot of that is just misinformation. But here's the problem. And you know this better than anybody. Agriculture is the only sector in business that I know of that has so many special interest groups. So, so many trade groups, so, so many commodity trade groups, that, I mean, if you went into the, retail business world, you have, you know, the Retail Business Association, and they represent everybody in retail, in agriculture.

00:28:02:23 - 00:28:20:00
Curt Covington
You've got the cotton interest, you got the Cornish, it's got soybean interest, you got the almond interest, you got the dairy interest. You get this. And they all are, you know, seeking a piece of the pie. The reality of the matter is it's really hard to have one voice when you've got 700 different trade associations speaking for you.

00:28:20:01 - 00:28:21:14
Curt Covington
Exactly.

00:28:21:16 - 00:28:27:09
Chrissy Wozniak
Yeah. Yeah. It would be great if we could just take a unified message that everybody agrees on and then go with it.

00:28:27:09 - 00:28:31:05
Curt Covington
We've tried, we've tried, but it's it, we've tried, but yeah.

00:28:31:07 - 00:28:48:00
Chrissy Wozniak
So yeah. Well, thank you so much for your time. I love talking to you. You're welcome back anytime. And and really, the this conversation is a testament to how important strategic planning is in agriculture. No matter where you are in agriculture.

00:28:48:02 - 00:28:50:04
Curt Covington
Yep. Thank you.

00:28:50:04 - 00:29:08:05
Chrissy Wozniak
Chris. You, yes. Thank you. And to our listeners, if you'd like to learn more, check the links in the show notes. And don't forget to subscribe to North American Tech Spotlight on Spotify, Apple, Amazon listening notes, or wherever you listen to podcasts if you prefer. Video we're on Rumble and Telegram as well, and if you found the episode helpful, please share it with your network and have a great day!